Wednesday, May 17, 2006

First video of Pentagon 9/11 attack released : Watchdog group says video will end 'conspiracy theories'

I really get tired of all the people who are so divorced from reality that they buy into these stupid September 11th conspiracy theories. However, as stupid as those are, it's even stupider to think that this video "will end conspiracy theories." First of all, there are just as many, if not more of these stupid theories surrounding the World Trade Center attacks as the Pentagon attack, and those manage to survive in the face of overwhelming video evidence that is clear and didn't take almost 5 years to come out, and that a lot of us actually watched live. Second, this video sucks. If I was on the fence and saw this video, it probably wouldn't tip me one way or another, but if it did, it would be towards the conspiracy side. You can barely see a plane at all. If someone believes that the government or whoever was able to pull off this hoax or whatever of a plane hitting the Pentagon, I have no doubt that they can easily believe that in 5 years a video could be faked, especially one this bad. The quotes make it sound like they expect all the conspiracy theory websites to take down all their nutcase data, and put this video up with some text saying, "Oops!" Somehow, I think the conspiracy theories will survive.

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22 comments:

Storm said...

Ok let me get this straight. Let us set aside the witnesses and the physical evidence and just look at the terrorists. Osama says he is going to attack us. In 1993 the towers get attacked. The leader vows to do it right next time. We get attacked in 2001. Osama then is videotaped praises his attackers. Several Muslims are videotaped around the MiddleEast cherring the attack. Even today somewhere I am sure you can find something on Alqeada's website praising those that took down the towers.

And yet there are those that do not believe?

I guess Bush also set up the attack in 1993, the attack on the USS Cole, and the attack in Somalia. OH wait I forgot the embassies in Africa.

Just admit it you hate Bush. It sounds much more intelligent.

Anonymous said...

It's ok the be skeptical about all the 911 "theories". However, being a successful, highly educated, technically oriented, business man - I can tell you that you should not throw the baby out with the bath water. While there are "theories" that are out there that are just crazy, there are significant questions about 911 that have been ignored and, as in the case of the 911 report, purely lied about to proctect peoples jobs. For example, it is simple not believable that the 911 report did not even address the collapse of WTC 7. It is not believable that NORAD relies solely on the FAA to track aircraft in US airspace (as alledged by the 911 report). It is not believable that GWB is so confused that on two separate public town meetings talks about how he saw the first plane hit the WTC on a TV "outside the classroom", when it was not possible for him to even see the second plane. It is not believable that the engine of flight 93 bounced 2 miles from the crash site. It is not believable that of all the 19 hijackers not one of the names made it onto the passanger lists furnished by the airlines. It is not believable that a simple pancake theory of the WTC 1 and 2 accounts for their falling at freefall speeds. It is not believable that if WTC 7 was brought down by the explosion of desiel fuel tanks that the building would symetrically implode, instead of asymetrically exploding. The list goes on and on and on.....There are not theories - there are facts.

John Howard said...

I'm not saying there aren't unanswered questions, of course there are, but that doesn't mean any kooky explanation that someone invents to solve them is correct. And your list of "facts" is pretty debatable as well. Why do you say the towers fell at freefall speeds? Clearly they didn't. And your speculation of how buildings implode or explode leads me to believe that you're one of those nuts that thinks the buildings were blown up using carefully placed explosives, which is just ridiculous. Why bother with the planes at all, then?

Anonymous said...

Pretty easy to tell how fast the towers fell, all you need is a video and a stop-watch. Every count I have heard is under 10seconds, I think it was about eight seconds or so. That is freefall. An apple droped from the top of one of those buildings would have reached the ground at a similar speed if (and only if) it encountered no more resistance than the air. The buildings didn't pancake, they imploded. Concrete, and other building material, office equipment and people became dust instantly. Recently it was reported in the New York Times that bone fragments each smaller than an inch or two were found on top of a nearby building. How could that happen without charges?

Michelline said...

Did you really do a post without cussing?? I'm impressed. Really.

Chris Howard said...

There were no charges. I think people undestimate the force of thousands of tons of glass, steel and concrete falling from great heights.

We all saw the planes hit, there is no need for other explantions. This is a perfect case for Occam's razor. Even if the towers had not collapsed, the effect politically would have been about the same. There are so many logical and practical holes in the explosive theory, it's not worth considering.

John Howard said...

They weren't in freefall. That's just ridiculous. Just look at some of the debris falling around the buildings that was in freefall and fell faster. You're crazy if you think someone blew them up. It's that simple. Chris is right, it's not even worth considering. And again, if someone went to the trouble of wiring the buildings up to explode (without anyone noticing), then why even bother with the planes at all?

John Howard said...

And I'm sure I must have cussed in there somewhere, but if not, it was a fucking oversight.

Storm said...

Hey assynomous

of course they imploded you idiot. If a hummer went through your house removing the load bearing center wall would not the exterior walls fall in towards the center of the house. Simple physics. And yes tons of concrete falling hundreds of feet on to a human would cause sufficient pressure to rupture the body.

Storm said...

Oh I almsot forgot

News flash if JRH and Chris and I all agree that means you are wrong because we hardly ever agree

John Howard said...

Yeah, good point storm.

Robert Bayn said...

I agree John, those who will believe stupid things, will continue to believe them, this video will not change that, i think Ron White says it best "You can't fix stupid".

Chris Howard said...

No need for namecalling, I think the argument speaks for itself. But it is very unusual to have the three of us on the same side of an issue.

Robert Bayn said...

Not really calling someone stupid, rather the situation stupid, i guess people have a reason to believe certain things, but i find it just stupid.

Storm said...

Chris stuff like this reminds me of Stephen King's It

"he thrusts his fists against the post and still insists he sees the ghost"

Which I interpret to mean some people can touch something and still insist it is not there

beakerkin said...

John

The countries most reknown expert on crank theories is Art Bell. He has called the 9-11 conspiracy nuts venomously anti semitic. The bottom line with all these theories is when you ask a kook who do you think is responsible it comes down to Jews and Israel.

Cranks work like this they take an inconsistent fact and build a conspiracy based largely on their own predjudices.

Fact Both planes that hit the WTC were carrying 200 bags of Potato Chips and Peanuts. So far not one bag has been found. This obviously infers that the salted snack evil Klingons were behind 9-11.

There are even Klingon youth chanting no war for Doritos back on their home planet.

The 9-11 conspiracy kooks are just more of the anti semitic goons of the far left that you pretend do not exist. When ever I hear an anti semitic remark invariably it comes from the "enlightened left".

Storm when you get a chance drop on in for a visit.

John Howard said...

I think you mean the country's most renowned crank is Art Bell. There may be some theories that are anti-semitic, but I haven't heard any. And saying that all these theories come down to anti semitism is just as nutty as the theories themselves.

I don't know any anti semetic goons, but I don't doubt they exist. And if they are on the left, they're clearly not enlightened. I really don't know what your point is. I think you're just obsessed with anti-semitism. I guess I shouldn't be surprised that you can take an issue where we all agree and turn it into an argument.

beakerkin said...

Number one you haven't taken the next step with the 9-11 conspiracy
goons. When you ask them who do you
think was responsible you get Mossad, CIA, Neocons ( evil Jewish
Republican in PC jargon) , Larry Silverstein and Haliburton. The theories boil down to the Jews.

John you happen to be very well aquainted with an anti semitic goon
from the UK. Have you ever read your old friend Mark the recidoofus
blog ?

He is quite fond of the term Zionist media. This is the pc anti semitic version of the Joooos dominate the media canard. Jews stole the Holocaust is another ditty of his.

" The Judea American Fascist Neocon
war on terror...." This is classic anti semitism of the first order.
Then you have Momma Moonbat Cindy Sheehan " My son didn't die for Israel.." . Then there is Ray McGovern running around blaming Israel for the war in Iraq.

The great Conservative Howard Dean
has said that any attempts to link Israel to the Iraq war are anti semitic.

John this is not to say you are a bad person. However you need to look at some of the people around you.

Art Bell is a radio host and I am more cynical then you about his views.

John Howard said...

I don't think all or even most of the theories boil down to the Jews. I don't doubt that some do.

Again, I think you're obsessed with anti-semitism. I have never once talked about Jewish people or anti-semitism on this blog, yet you constantly bring it up in comments. I have no doubt that it is a big problem, however, when you inject it into every conversation that has nothing to do with it, it weakens your position.

I haven't read Mark's blog lately, but when I did I never saw anything anti-semitic there.

Perhaps there are important things in the world that aren't related to the Jews/Israel/Anti-Semitism.

beakerkin said...

John

I wish it were so and that those on the left were as noble as you. However, you should not remain oblivious to what is around you. That being said I think that if people were pointing the finger at other minorities you might not be so blase.

John Howard said...

But that's the whole point, beakerkin, no one in this discussion is pointing any fingers at Jews. It's you who brought it up, and you who talk about it in just about any conversation, regardless of its relevance. Again, I'll say that any conspiracy theories blamingthe Jews are just as stupid as the others, and just as stupid as people like Pat Robertson or Fred Phelps blaming it indirectly on the gays. But my point is that not all these theories are about anti-semitism, they just aren't.

beakerkin said...

John

Unlike you I talk to the far left fringe in NYC . The second one asks them who do think did it the same answer comes out. I have done this numerous times and got the same response. Do not take my word for it try it.